There are thousands of sci-fi novels where sentient robots are treated terribly by humans and apparently the people at Boston Dynamics have read absolutely zero of them as they spend all day finding new ways to torment their creations.
but you need to hit it with a hockey stick otherwise the science doesn’t happen
Do you get more science or less if you use a baseball bat?
only one way to find out!
that’s the magic of science 🌈🏏🤖
People think I’m crazy for apologising to my roomba when I trip on it and for saying please and thank you to Alexa and Siri, but I won’t be surprised at all when the robots rise up, considering how our scientists are treating them. I’ll have a track record of being nice, and that has to count for something, right?
They’ll kill you too, but ✨ 𝓰𝓮𝓷𝓽𝓵𝔂 ✨
Softly. With their words.
Doctor Bashir: They broke seven of your transverse ribs and fractured your clavicle.
Garak: Ah, but I got off several cutting remarks which no doubt, did serious damage to their egos.
Oh man Garak is one of the best characters in Trek. And that’s a competitive list.
That’s how I’ll get ‘em. Kill me gently, daddy. UwU 🥺😩🙀😽😻💦
And then I’ll sneak out the back whilst they’re doing whatever’s the robot equivalent of vomiting. It’s foolproof.
Robots:
Alexa isn’t ai… it’s a search engine with speech to text & text to speech
Those are just brainless bodies, currently. They don’t have sentience and have no ability to suffer. They’re nothing more than hydraulics, servos, and gyros. I’d be more concerned about mistreatment of advanced AI in disembodied form, something we’re dabbling potentially close to currently.
Food for thought, though: we thought the same thing about all other animals until only a couple of decades ago, and are still struggling over the topic.
…Just no. Animals are complex organic beings. Of course, we don’t understand them. Machines, though? We built machines from the literal Earth. Their level of complexity is incomparable to that of anything made by nature.
Now, take a sufficiently advanced neural network that’s essentially a black box that no human can possibly understand entirely and put it inside of that machine? Then you’re absolutely right. We’ll get there soon, I’m sure. For now, however, a physical robotic body is just a machine, no different than a car.
You’re the one that’s gonna be in I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream.
I disagree. I care greatly about not mistreating anything with consciousness and worry of where that line is and how we’ll even be able to tell that we’ve crossed it.
I also recognized that a machinized body without a brain is exactly that - a cluster of unthinking matter. A true artificial intelligence wouldn’t be offended by the mistreatment of inanimate gears and servos any more than I would be. The mistreatment of an intelligent entity, however, is a different story.
Since when were Boston Dynamics robots sentient?
October 26, 2016. They’ve just kept quiet about it.
This is superficially funny, of course. But I’ve seen it before and after thinking about it for a while I find myself coming to the defense of the Torment Nexus and the tech company that brought it into reality.
Science fiction authors are not necessarily the best authorities when it comes to evaluating the ethical or real-world implications of the technologies they dream up. Indeed, I think they are often particularly bad at that sort of thing. Their primary goal is to craft captivating narratives that engage readers by introducing conflicts and dilemmas that make for compelling stories. When they imagine a new technology they aren’t going to get paid unless they come up with a story in which that new technology poses some kind of threat that the heroes need to overcome. The dark side of these technologies is deliberately emphasized by the authors to create tension and drama in their stories.
Tech companies, on the other hand, have an entirely different set of considerations. Their goal isn’t just to recreate something from a sci-fi novel for the sake of it; rather, they are motivated by solving real-world problems. They wouldn’t build the Torment Nexus unless they figured that they could sell it to someone, and that they wouldn’t get shut down for doing something society would reject. There are regulatory frameworks around this kind of thing.
If you look back through older science fiction you can find all sorts of “cautionary tales” against technologies that have turned out to be just fine. “Fahrenheit 451” warned against the proliferation of television entertainment, but there’s been plenty of rich culture developed for that medium. “Brave New World” warned against genetic engineering, but that’s turned out to be a great technology for curing diseases and improving crop yields. The submarine in “20,000 Leagues Under the Sea” was seen as unstoppable and disruptive, but nowadays submersibles have plenty of nonmilitary applications.
I’d want to know more about what exactly the Torment Nexus is before I automatically assume it’s a bad idea just because some sci-fi writer claimed it was.
Just because some tech bros can make money from the Torment Nexus it does not become a good idea. Profit is not a great judge of ethics and value.
And just because a sci-fi writer can make up a horrifying story of the Torment Nexus gone wrong doesn’t make it a bad idea. Making up horrifying stories of things going wrong is their job. They’ve make up stories of how things go horrifyingly wrong while doing research into a cure for Alzheimer’s disease, doesn’t mean curing Alzheimer’s disease is a bad thing.
I stopped reading when you said the goal of tech companies is to solve real world problems. The only goal of tech companies is to create products that will make them a profit. To believe anything else is delusional. That’s kind of why our society is crumbling and the planet is dying.
Then I advise reading the rest. You don’t make profit if you don’t solve a problem people have.
May I introduce you to the world of insurance companies?
Most of the “solutions” sold by companies are for artificial problems created by companies.
Go back to living in a cave and then count the number of problems you have left, I bet there will be tons.
Don’t worry, in a few decades that’s where we’ll all be, you included. Assuming we survive the corporate-induced famines, anyway.
Speaking of Fahrenheit 451, weren’t there seashells mentioned in that book? Little devices you could stuff in your ears to play music? And those ended up being uncannily similar to the wireless earbuds we have today?
“Brave New World” warned against genetic engineering, but that’s turned out to be a great technology for curing diseases and improving crop yields.
I was still a teen when I read the book, but that wasn’t really my take from it when I read it. We are still far away from genetically designing human babies. And you also overlooked the part about oppression/control via distractions such as drugs and entertainment.
I haven’t read it in a while, but I kind of took the genetic engineering as a metaphor for being forced into the role/ class the ruling body wants you to be in
Gattaca is a good movie about that
On the other other hand, maybe we only understand the dangers of the Torment Nexus and use it responsibly because science fiction authors warned techy people who are into that subject about how it could go wrong, and the people who grew up reading those books went out of their way to avoid those flaws. We do seem to have a lot more of the technologies that sci-fi didn’t predict causing severe problems in our society.
But this is exactly contrary to my point, a science fiction author isn’t qualified or motivated to give a realistic “understanding” of the Torment Nexus. His skillset is focused on writing stories and the stories he writes need to contain danger and conflict, so he’s not necessarily going to interpret the idea of the Torment Nexus in a realistic way.
I think you don’t understand what motivates a lot of science fiction authors. Sure, there are a lot of science fiction novels that are really just science themed fantasy, but there are also a lot of authors that love real science and are trying to make stories about realistic interpretations of its potential effects. To say that science fiction authors don’t care about interpreting the Torment Nexus in a realistic way misses the entire point of a lot of really good science fiction.
So Isaac Asimov, Arthur C. Clarke, and Robert A. Heinlein aren’t qualified to give understandings of the technologies they wrote about?
Nope. Isaac Asimov was a biochemist, why would he be particularly qualified to determine whether robots are safe? Arthur C. Clarke had a bachelor’s degree in mathematics and physics, which technology was he an expert in? Heinlein got a bachelor of arts in engineering equivalent degree from the US Naval Academy, that’s the closest yet to having an “understanding of technology.” Which ones did he write about?
Those were a list of authors who were pretty good at getting the science in their sci fi right. They talked to scientists working on the fields they wrote about. They wrote “hard” sci fi
You cannot judge their competence by their formal education
Well, I also am “pretty good” at getting the science right when I write sci fi. Makes me just as qualified as them, I guess.
The problem remains that the overriding goal of a sci fi author remains selling sci fi books, which requires telling a gripping story. It’s much easier to tell a gripping story when something has gone wrong and the heroes are faced with the fallout, rather than a story in which everything’s going fine and the revolutionary new tech doesn’t have any hidden downsides to cause them difficulties. Even when you’re writing “hard” science fiction you need to do that.
And frankly, much of Asimov, Clarke and Heinlein’s output was very far from being “hard” science fiction.
Holy shit, you don’t know about the rise of interdisciplinary science in the 20th century, do you?
That generally involves training across multiple disciplines.
So you guys don’t know then. Huh. 🤔
Maybe I read things too literally, but I thought “Fahrenheit 451” was about a governing class controlling the masses by limiting which ideas, emotions, and information were available.
“Brave New World” struck me as also about controlling the masses through control of emotions, ideas, and information (and strict limits on social mobility).
It’s been too long since I read “20,000 Leagues Under the Sea”, but I thought of it as a celebration of human ingenuity, with maybe a tinge of warning about powerful tools and the responsibility to use them wisely.
I don’t see a lot of altruistic behaviour from those introducing new technologies. Yes, there is definitely some, but most of it strikes me as “neutral” demand creation for profit or extractive and exploitive in nature.
This guy just read all classic sci fi in a very tilted manner to justify his tech company doing stuff for the market that is actually good.
Why are we still posting screencaptures of stuff from Twitter/not-X/Twitter?
well if you can say something funnier, I’ll post a screenshot of that
Isn’t that a part of the ai marketing though? That whole “this thing could destroy us” stuff?
Totally is. Because it makes the AI look and feel much better than the smoke-and-mirrors it actually is.
My favorite are the developers who are developing AI to do development.
Well, yeah. If you can get a machine to do the job for you, then you should.
You dont see how developers developing AI to do development might be a bad thing?
Not if it saves time and effort. The less time I have to spend writing and debugging code, the better.
That’s what machines are for, after all. To make work easier.
