Put it in H!
What country does this car come from?
The country it comes from no longer exists!
I always hated this instruction. When instead I had it explained that one can think of it as fading the clutch out and fading the accelerator in (and that points in between are fine too) I immediately understood and never had an issue again. Admittedly I stalled a few times when switching to a different car whilst I learned its specific tolerances, but conceptually I was golden.
…now I drive an electric car.
Really depends on the amount of torque your car has at idle, in some you don’t need to touch the gas pedal at all to set off.
Or how good the anti-stall system is, the car I learned in was basically impossible to stall by letting the clutch up too fast, it would just automatically fade in power.
Also it’s never taught that you should lift the clutch to the bite point and keep it still until the car builds up some momentum. I think people do it so subconsciously that it doesn’t occur to them that that’s the key to moving from a standstill.
This wasn’t taught to me either but this is the best thing for teaching others. I’ve explained this to a few people before that were struggling to learn and it made the process much easier.
I love teaching my friends how to drive stick. The first lesson is how to make the idle car move by lifting the clutch foot so slow that you can feel the car move and keep going slowly until the foot is off the clutch pedal. It’s about a 15 minute lesson and the driver understands what to do with the clutch. The gas is easy.
In their own car right? That’ll kill the clutch after a few friends. It’s entirely possible to do, but thats hella unhealthy wear on the clutch. The parking lot must just reek when you’re done.
You aren’t having them redline the engine and slip the clutch going up a hill. Practicing idle starts in first is probably way less wear than a single sporty start on a highway on ramp.
Nope. I teach them in my car. And yeah, the car might sometimes stutter but that doesn’t hurt anything. It’s hard to harm to a clutch without using the gas pedal or a graded street.
It’s slow, but in most cars the idle is torquey enough that it’s not that slow. My beater doesn’t even have 1st gear anymore, so I start in second, and I can still go from a full stop to clutch fully released and rolling in like 4 seconds (if that) without touching the gas at all.
I feel like this is something that you just have to do to learn though. You can’t smoothly and competently operate the clutch without understanding the bite-point, and for a noob it’s going to be really tough to get a feel for that bite-point if they aren’t taking it very slow at first. Speed will come, usually after only a few starts
It’s also nicer to pedestrians and other drivers if the car isn’t sporadically revving or lurching.
Exactly! In city driving or parking lots when I’m just creeping around I literally don’t touch the gas at all sometimes
On principle I only teach in their car, but made an exception for my friend’s husband since he wanted to rent a manual overseas. I learned my lesson, he didn’t
It depends on the car, my first car used gasoline, so the idle torque was low and you really needed to push the gas at the same time, otherwise it would stall, maybe not if you are releasing the clutch extremely slow, but that is not practical.
My current diesel car has so much torque even at idle that you really don’t need to press the gas pedal while releasing the clutch.
I was taught that. I learned driving in Germany, though.
It’s like learning to ride a bike. There’s all this balance going on, but after you’re good at it it’s just natural and you kind of forget how to explain what to do because you stopped thinking about it so long ago.
Only thing I drive is OP’s mom wild with pleasure.
My parents insisted I learn on a manual, and while I didn’t appreciate it at the time, I do now.
The regional DMV office where I took my driving exam had the most notorious parallel parking setup in the state. It was two traffic cones next to a very large, 3 1/2 foot diameter log (representing the curb) and was on the side of a circular cul-de-sac. So not only did you have to account for the curvature, if you got too close to the “curb”, you were gonna have a very bad day lol.
If you’re wondering: I nailed it (they let you practice after hours which helped).
What’s wrong with just driving through the nearby streets and searching for a fitting spot for parking?
AFAIK, it’s mostly due to how the driving exams are structured.
First you have to pass the written exam. If you fail that, you don’t continue.
After the written exam is the parallel parking test. That’s done on-site. If you don’t pass that part, you don’t continue to the road test.
The road test is last; it’s up to the instructor where you go for that, but it usually is a route that covers various scenarios that were on the exam (4-way stops, crosswalks, speed transition zones, school zones, etc).
I’d guess it’s setup that way because of how many people fail the parallel parking test; best to do that in a controlled environment where there’s no risk to regular people’s cars out in the wild.
Edit: This probably varies state-by-state, too. I’m just describing how it was here.
If you don’t have control over the finer movements of your car, parallel park is a pretty good way to weed it out. And if they don’t, you’re gonna fuck up harder in a place that actually matters.
Fuck up when it doesn’t matter so you don’t fuck up when it matters.
What does manual transmission have to do with parallel parking?
Nothing other than increasing the difficulty for a novice driver. Mostly it’s me going on a tangent and reminiscing about defeating that fucking log lol.
From my experience it’s a lot easier to drive slowly just woth the clutch instead of the gas pedam
Absolutely. Clutch control is super useful.
It’s not just the clutch. Rev up the engine too.
Now you killed it while lurching forward! Exciting!
While learning, don’t touch the gas. Learn how to take the car out of neutral and into first using only the clutch. Then the whole process makes a lot more sense for when you need to do it faster.
No, you didn’t “kill it”, you gave it what it needs and then released the clutch. Slowly letting go till it bites doesn’t make any sense, especially when going uphill. The clutch can take moving a tiny bit faster, the engine cannot take it moving a lot slower. If you lurch, you gave it a ton of gas, instead of keeping it at like 3k range max.
Basically, train on a level surface. Push in the clutch fully, break fully. Then let go of break, and push the gas in slightly. Learn how far you need to push it to keep it at 3k or so, depending on your vehicle. Then, the most important part. Gas doesn’t make your vehicle go, the release of the clutch does. Once you figure out that it’s the left leg that makes it “go” instead of the right, you’ll get it every time, uphill or not. It only needs the tiny amount of initial gas to be good.
None of this "wait till the cars starts rolling and then you have a quarter of a milisecond to add gas before it dies on you.
The “don’t touch the gas” thing is mostly just a learning exercise for people brand-new to driving stick to get a feel for where their clutch bites and how it slips, it’s not the way to start a car rolling, certainly not on hills. Though anecdotally, I’ve driven at least a dozen manual transmission cars and trucks and only one lacked the torque to start and roll just idling - because we found out later that its timing jumped a tooth. So this line
None of this "wait till the cars starts rolling and then you have a quarter of a milisecond to add gas before it dies on you.
makes me suspect that there’s something up with your car? Even if it can’t start from idle, any car should be able roll in idle
You don’t have to drive stick…
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No thanks. I like a manual gearbox because it’s fun, I feel in control. I don’t want to rely on electronics for something less fun. I don’t care if automatics are now faster, or if paddles are faster. They’re not as fun.
I thought paddles would be cool. My first 335i was a dct and I eventually sold it for a real manual 335i. It’s really gonna suck when manual is truly gone :(
6mt 335 gang unite. I love mine.
I’ve had my 2011 for 9 years, best car
Just get an automatic
laughs in electric drivetrain
Voltage up.
Voltage down.
Simple. No additional headache.
3 phase synchronous motors want a word with you!
Ahh but its so worth it. Also just take the bus lol, driving should only be for fun. Make all fuel eco and its gonna be more expensive but cars as a form of transport are horrible. I like driving but i also like swimming and that doesnt mean i want to swim to school/work.
A tip for this: the accelerator is less important, slowly release the clutch until you feel the car vibrating, then you can release the brakes and the car will not move, or start moving slowly, then you can start accelerating and releasing the rest of the clutch.
What if you’re on a hill?
You try not to park on hills haha. But the concept is the same you just get better/quicker at doing it. When you’re letting off the clutch, the engine is connected to the wheels. Its enough to not need the brakes so you give it a bit more gas to get over the resistance of trying to go up a hill versus flat ground.
But some manuals will “hold” the brakes for a few seconds after you let off the brake pedal.
Also, everyone who drives manual stalls. You just laugh at how dumb you are and try again.
Use the handbrake. At least that’s how I learned it. Back when the handbrake was a lever connected by a steel cable to the break pads. Man I’m old.
Or do as the little old lady next to me in a car park yesterday: push the accelerator until the little needle is at 6000 (because you need to get up at 6), put the car in reverse and slowly adjust your speed with the clutch.
Either Honda accords have a pretty good clutch, or she was on her 9th by the look of the car.
Update: it went something like this https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VCNzvKvIRhk it’s in Danish, but I think it’s pretty self explanatory
That’s how learned basically, we have a lot of free way exits that leave you going uphill at a red light so that’s how I kept from rolling back into the car sniffing my exhaust
When I taught my brother and sis, after they got frustrated not finding the balance or the car dieing, I just told them to give it some real gas. If they’re apprehensive about it. I told them to just floor it in neutral to show nothing is gonna happen to the motor and it just hits the limiter. So after 30 minutes of them just focusing on slowly releasing the clutch while revving high, they had it down. Another 15 minutes and they were going up to 2k rpm while working the clutch.
Yes, I had to replace the clutch after teaching them both. Small price to pay for them now being able to drive anything.
My father in law decided randomly one day I was going to learn to drive manual. So he started up the pickup truck, and said “it’s easy to get started going down hill” as he demonstrated rolling down a steep hill. Then he u-turned, parked the truck at the bottom of that steep hill, turned off the engine got out and said “your turn”. Dick.
Lol volkswagen autostart Slows down for speed bump. Engine turns off.
Autostart and lane assist are turned off in my car.
🤮 So glad my stop-start has been broken on my Hyundai for years now, everything else works though
Wait this happens?? Lmao
Yeah. Know problem in my polo. Have to turn stopstart each time you start the car
Automatic transmission ❤️
Try as I might I don’t think I’ll ever understand people who like manual transmission. I think it’s like some kind of elitism thing? I can drive the annoying esoteric vehicle so I’m better than you?
It’s not like it actually makes you go faster, automatic transmissions are pretty good these days. I’ve tried to drive manual vehicles and it just required way too much of my attention for what should be a simple means of conveyance.
I’ve tried to drive manual vehicles and it just required way too much of my attention for what should be a simple means of conveyance.
Driving a manual doesn’t require any more attention than an automatic. Here almost everyone learns in a manual and by the time you get your license it’s something you don’t need to think about.
If you’re used to manual, driving an automatic for the first time is a pretty scary experience. Half the controls you need to operate the car are missing.
It’s not an elitism thing as almost everyone drives a manual. My late mom drove a manual at 72, including dragging a big caravan all across Europe.
Used to be that the only people who drove an automatic were people with (mental) health issues. If you got a manual-only license it used to have a big stamp across it that said ‘AUTOMATIC ONLY’. If you got one of those as a physically healthy 18yo it might as well have said ‘RETARDED’, as that would have been the only reason to get one.
Nowadays with electric cars becoming more common having an automatic-only license has become socially acceptable.
It’s weird to me that y’all don’t appreciate the convenience of advancing technology.
It’s like going “only mentally disabled folks use microwaves, the rest of us light the wood stove and let it simmer for a half hour”
Especially when Europe is known for its electric kettles, which are only recently becoming common in the US, who have traditionally used range-heated kettles.
Shit… are you also all still on Nokia 3310s and connecting to the internet with SLIP/PPP too?
It’s weird to me that y’all don’t appreciate the convenience of advancing technology.
You’re operating from the incorrect assumption that an automatic is more convenient while it isn’t.
Try this: stand up, walk to the other side of the room and back. Was that inconvenient? Did you have to consciously place your legs and think about how to use your feet? No. You just want to go in a certain direction and your legs just move without you needing to think about it.
Driving a manual is the same. You don’t consciously operate the gearbox, you just drive. Shifting gears doesn’t require conscious thought. An automatic isn’t convenient, quite the opposite, as it gives you less control.
Why don’t you use a wheelchair? Surely rolling around is more convenient than balancing on two legs? It’s because balancing on two legs isn’t actually that inconvenient once you learned how. It was when you were a baby, but we help babies learn to walk instead of putting them in a wheelchair. Same goes for driving a manual. Once you learn to a point where you no longer need to think about it, it’s more convenient than an automatic.
It’s like going “only mentally disabled folks use microwaves, the rest of us light the wood stove and let it simmer for a half hour”
Good analogy. Now go microwave a steak while I cook one over a wood fire, which steak do you think will turn out the most delicious?
Try this: stand up, walk to the other side of the room and back
I mean, I have spondylitic arthritis, but okay. (Luckily I got on the good meds again.)
which steak do you think will turn out the most delicious?
Ah but the question wasn’t quality, it was convenience.
Even if you argue that after a while the less convenient becomes familiar, that doesn’t really mean it was more convenient, it was just not inconvenient for you. But I have to say even if you’re a seasoned manual driver, not having to shift every 25mph is arguably more convenient than having to, even if you’ve gotten used to it.
People got used to climbing stairs, doesn’t mean we stopped using elevators.
Even if you argue that after a while the less convenient becomes familiar, that doesn’t really mean it was more convenient, it was just not inconvenient for you. But I have to say even if you’re a seasoned manual driver, not having to shift every 25mph is arguably more convenient than having to, even if you’ve gotten used to it.
You keep assuming it’s an inconvenience that you have to ‘get used to’, that’s not the case at all.
Let’s us another example: typing. You have to learn to type, that’s inconvenient, right? When you first learn to type you have to look at the keys and hunt-and-peck to find the right keys to press. Why would you learn this when every modern computer and smartphone has speech-to-text? You can simply speak instead of typing, nothing to learn, much more convenient, right?
Except it’s not. Using speech as an input mechanism is annoying and inconvenient, it’s slow, it’s annoying to people around you, privacy is an issue in any shared space, etc. Typing by contrast is fast once you’ve learned it. You no longer consciously have to search for the keys on your keyboard or even think about it. You just think what you want to type and the words appear on your screen, your fingers move to the right keys with you barely aware of what they are doing.
The same happens in a car, even an automatic. If you want to go faster, the car goes faster, you aren’t really aware of your foot pressing the gas pedal. If you want to slow down, the car slows down, you don’t have to think about operating the break pedal, that’s just something that happens of which you are barely aware. The car basically becomes an extension of your body. The same goes for shifting, it’s not an inconvenience as you are barely aware that you are doing it. It’s like breathing. Sure, if you pay attention to it you notice, and you can consciously control it, but 99,999% of the time it’s just something that happens automatically.
As I said, the car becomes an extension of your body, and this is not something that happens ‘after a while’. it happens in the first 10 or so driving lessons. When you first get in the car on your first lesson, you are a person sitting inside a car operating it. By the 10th lesson or so you are no longer a person in car, you are the car. This happens whether or not it’s an automatic or manual. The only difference is that with a manual you have a little more control over this extended body than with an automatic. I’ve owned an automatic and that lack of control is a mild inconvenience. The automatic gearbox doesn’t know what is happening ahead of you, it can’t anticipate, so you get small annoyances like it shifting up when you know you need to slow down in a second to take a corner, and then it’s in the wrong gear and it has to shift down again when you need to accelerate out of the corner. The gearbox is not clairvoyant so it doesn’t know what I’m about to do and it’s always a little too late. It’s a small inconvenience that you don’t have with a manual.
Actually there used to be another, more important reason:
Back in the old days, automatic transmissions accelerated pretty slowly. It was not possible to accelerate normally – or what we thought to be normal. No one in their right mind would pay ~5–10 % more (automatic transmissions used to be expensive) to get a lame car and annoy everybody at every traffic light. I don’t know when automatic transmissions got as fast as manual shifting, but this memo hasn’t reached Europe yet.
And, last but not least, and only still valid argument: automatic transmissions are still more expensive than manual ones. Why should I pay extra money for some fancy tech with no extra benefit that takes away my illusion of control and feels horrible to drive?
automatic transmissions are still more expensive than manual ones
Is it still though? I dare say it is becoming increasingly common (in the US) that in order to get a manual transmission you have to make a special order.
Had a previous car that was manual. Then I bought a car with a CVT (continuously variable transmission) and it’s such a nuisance because it is always unpredictable when it will shift. So you go to pass someone, step on the gas and sometimes it takes off and other times it fiddles with shifting for a second before giving you any power. Can also be a real pain in stop and go traffic because it will have unpredictable amounts of power when starting from a stop. I’ve had this vehicle since 2017 and it’s always been this way. I don’t miss having to shift constantly but I do miss having a reliable amount of power when I’m in a certain gear - that’s what is so nice about a manual transmission. You feel more in control of the car. That said, my daily driver now is electric with no transmission and that is the best of all.
Those shift points are artificial, unnecessary and only programmed that way because people are used to it.
Is your CVT vehicle a Honda? I know Nissan CVTs have had their issues but the Toyota ones have a fixed/real first gear before they switch to the CVT to give you that reliable start from 0 mph/kph.
- Manuals are more engaging. Getting a smooth shift or a perfect rev match on a downshift is very satisfying. Shifting gears when your have a car with a smooth, very mechanically connected shifter feels even more satisfying.
- If you ever have to gun it in an emergency with a manual the acceleration is instant. In an automatic you have to wait a few seconds for the transmission to figure out what gear it wants to be in before anything actually happens.
- Generally, in an automatic, the connection between the engine and the wheels doesn’t feel very mechanical. It feels like they are connected by a rubber band.
- In a manual you feel much more like the car is an extension of you.
- Going back to driving an automatic usually feels like you’re being handed a children’s toy. The whole experience feels hollow and neutered like it’s missing something substantial.
I guess there can be some elitist mindset to being able to do something that fewer and fewer people can do. But thinking that this is the main reason why people love driving stick is downright ignorant.
The “satisfaction” is probably novelty. UK/EU, nobody thinks about it.
I think there’s a kind of fetishisation of manual transmission in the US. Like your emergency scenario: I guess if you need to accelerate away from 30-50 feral hogs then you might welcome it.
No automatic takes “a few seconds” to gun it, I think you might be the one with the flawed experience
Manual: floor it, instant pull. If I want to downshift I will.
Automatic: floor it, hesitation, downshift, revs go higher but nothing happens because it isn’t sure if it wants to downshift again, hesitation, downshifts, revs go crazy and outside of power band or just at the top end of it, shitty pull, upshifts almost right after. Finally some pull after wasting three seconds.
I’ve driven countless various automatic vehicles. They all do that to varying degrees of disappointment.
The only time I had a delay was when I had a car that took half a second for VTEC to kick in, I’ve never had an automatic that took SECONDS to go vroom
There is a difference between engine noise and actual acceleration.
I was referring to acceleration.
It’s just more fun dude. Manual transmissions make shitty cars bearable, and nicer cars exhilarating. Plus I really like having that direct control over the car. Plus they tend to be more reliable and cheaper to repair. There’s not much else too it.
I’ve tried to drive manual vehicles and it just required way too much of my attention for what should be a simple means of conveyance.
That just means that you haven’t developed the muscle memory yet, you had that same learning period with every other aspect of driving, operating a manual transmission is just one more. So you know, if you’re serious, practice.
I’ve been driving manuals exclusively for so long that I actually have the opposite problem, In the rare situations that I need to drive an auto, I have to be super careful and mindful. I’ve literally stabbed the brake before in an auto with my left foot instinctively looking for the clutch, so I have to conciously keep that foot still.
It’s more enjoyable is the main thing. It’s more fun to drive a manual car to many people and that’s their appeal. There are a few other advantages to it as well. They’re generally more reliable and have better fuel economy and performance than automatics that were offered until the 2010s.
Because they like it. It’s engaging.
But it also forces you to pay better attention, I’m just not going to get snippy about it.
You complaining about the attention… Terrifying. Jesus, you can kill someone.
At some point in time it was argued that manual allowed finer control of engine efficiency to automatic which simply shifted at certain speeds or rpms that weren’t always ideal. So properly driving a manual meant you saved gas.
I dare say in the decades since that argument began, automatic transmissions have gotten way better and reasonably as efficient as the average manual driver.
Also, when manuals were more generally common, they were generally cheaper than automatics. I don’t know if that’s true anymore, but I think the average person will have a hard time finding a manual new (consumer grade) vehicle in any given dealership in the US these days – you’d have to get it ordered.
Esoteric? I’ve only encountered a handful of automatic cars in my life here in the UK. Having a licence that only covers automatic has historically been rather limiting here. The only person I know that has that has dyspraxia.
For me the appeal of a manual transmission is in engine braking. When driving an ICE car I barely need the brakes because the majority of my speed management is through engine braking. Fortunately my electric car has the option for pseudo engine braking - and it charges the battery too!
Automatic cars also have engine braking.
Yeah but it’s not really feasible to use it at every corner and stop like you can a manual car. Engine braking in an auto is mostly just for doing long descents without riding the brakes too much
Some cars have ‘hard’ regenerative braking but yea, it’s rare (thinking about Tesla)
Regen is just an electric car thing though, no? And EVs (with very few exceptions) don’t have a transmission at all?
Regen has been on trains for a long time, fwiw.
Uhhh that sounds right
To be fair I know close to nothing about cars and mechanics
When I’ve driven an automatic I could only manually set the gears for first and second. I’m sure that’s not universal as nothing is, but I can only speak to my own experience.
I would usually use fourth when decelerating up to a junction and then switch directly to second as I get close, as an example.
I believe they’re just cheaper and technically they allow you to get a bit more from your car, but yea apart from that, not much
In some countries there are more manual cars so I get them, but trashing on automatic is just dumb. It’s much more enjoyable (people I know told me that). Most manual drivers have muscle memory so it’s not really something that takes too much place in their mind, but I guess having to remember less could make you more focused on the road.
Disclaimer: I have an automatic driver license, and no manual driver license haha
having to remember less could make you more focused on the road.
On contrary, in my opinion. Especially in cities, where manual forces me to anticipate the next turn, light or other drivers. Automatic makes me zone out and focus on everything but driving.
ADHD?
Not that I know of.
Most people have manual cars in the UK. Automatics are the weirder, more esoteric ones to us.
I think it’s more or less a cultural thing at this point
FWIW I believe competitive drivers prefer manual control (even if the gearbox itself is automatic) because controlling when the gear change happens can make a difference in a race
I heard that automatic cars were more common in the USA but idk if that’s true
Nearly 98% of cars sold in the US are automatic. Manual transmissions are often not even an option for a lot of models.
That explains it then! Thanks :)
annoying esoteric vehicle
You’re making it sound a lot harder and more painful than it is. Do you also judge people who ride 2-wheeled vehicles that “require attention” for staying balanced?
“I don’t like X, therefore people who like X can’t possibly like it for real and must be pretending. In fact, they are elitists who only do it to feel superior to me.”
C’mon mate.
