Jews, Muslims, and Christians lived in that area together for hundreds of years. This is a political conflict. The fucking Israeli settlers are psychopaths who roll into towns and start setting things on fire. It’s about territory, like all colonialist aggression.
Religion does have a nonzero influence, but you’re correct in that this is primarily a political conflict. Zionists murder Muslim and Christian Palestinians alike, and Fatah, a secular resistance movement, was the leading org of the Palestinian side for the longest time.
Okay, so by “Zionists” are you referring exclusively to members of the Israeli government or might there perhaps be a broader ideology at play here? The meme reeks of a Bernie Sanders-esqe “Netanyahu is the problem” kind of narrative.
I don’t care where they go, just leave the fucking indigenous people alone.
Okay, so by “Zionists” are you referring exclusively to members of the Israeli government or might there perhaps be a broader ideology at play here?
There’s a broader ideology at play here that is very deeply engrained in Israeli society.
The meme reeks of a Bernie Sanders-esqe “Netanyahu is the problem” kind of narrative.
Sanders is a politician, not a polisci professor. Politicians say what they think will get them closer to the solutions they think they can achieve, not necessarily what is objectively correct. “We need to get rid of the worst of the genociders who has sparked the current wave of genocide, and condemning 70% of Israeli society, however correctly, will not give us the allies we need to reduce the current stage of the genocide and move to the next step of a just and lasting peace” kind of thinking - Sanders has long been a radical, by US standards, voice in support of the Palestinian cause. Thinking that him focusing on the most immediate enemy is condemnation worthy is blinkered at best.
I don’t care where they go, just leave the fucking indigenous people alone.
… do you care if Israelis in Israeli-majority areas recognized by international law as part of the state of Israel remain in Israel, where many of them were born and raised?
Religion isn’t fueling it, it is just used as moral justification from both sides. If religion didn’t exist the same thing would happen, but with a different form of moral justification.
I think you’re wrong about religion. You’re trying to say that religion is used as justification afterwards, but we know that real numbers of religious nuts will endorse horrible things because of their religious beliefs.
In other words, would there be less violence occurring in that region if nobody had any religious beliefs? I think the answer has to be “probably yes”. We know this by talking to people, by looking at religious zealots throughout history. But even if our logic is correct, we cannot accurately guess how much less violence would be occurring if the region were full of atheists.
And in some sense our counterfactual thought experiment doesn’t even matter because the reality is that region is of great religious significance and you can’t really write that off as being irrelevant when several millennia prove that it is.
This is what I said and then someone blew up in my face about it when I said this in another thread/post. Why are people so hard headed when it comes to accepting reality I wonder.
If it wasn’t religion it would be race or ideology or language or eye color. You could press a button and eliminate religion from history and all of these problems would still exist.
I mean sure. Don’t me a racist bigot. Of course.
But let’s not pretend that religion isn’t fueling the atrocities being committed on both sides of the conflict.
Removed by mod
Lol the npc is strong with this one.
Jews, Muslims, and Christians lived in that area together for hundreds of years. This is a political conflict. The fucking Israeli settlers are psychopaths who roll into towns and start setting things on fire. It’s about territory, like all colonialist aggression.
Just gonna leave this here…
Religion does have a nonzero influence, but you’re correct in that this is primarily a political conflict. Zionists murder Muslim and Christian Palestinians alike, and Fatah, a secular resistance movement, was the leading org of the Palestinian side for the longest time.
Okay, so by “Zionists” are you referring exclusively to members of the Israeli government or might there perhaps be a broader ideology at play here? The meme reeks of a Bernie Sanders-esqe “Netanyahu is the problem” kind of narrative.
I don’t care where they go, just leave the fucking indigenous people alone.
There’s a broader ideology at play here that is very deeply engrained in Israeli society.
Sanders is a politician, not a polisci professor. Politicians say what they think will get them closer to the solutions they think they can achieve, not necessarily what is objectively correct. “We need to get rid of the worst of the genociders who has sparked the current wave of genocide, and condemning 70% of Israeli society, however correctly, will not give us the allies we need to reduce the current stage of the genocide and move to the next step of a just and lasting peace” kind of thinking - Sanders has long been a radical, by US standards, voice in support of the Palestinian cause. Thinking that him focusing on the most immediate enemy is condemnation worthy is blinkered at best.
… do you care if Israelis in Israeli-majority areas recognized by international law as part of the state of Israel remain in Israel, where many of them were born and raised?
Religion isn’t fueling it, it is just used as moral justification from both sides. If religion didn’t exist the same thing would happen, but with a different form of moral justification.
I think you’re wrong about religion. You’re trying to say that religion is used as justification afterwards, but we know that real numbers of religious nuts will endorse horrible things because of their religious beliefs.
In other words, would there be less violence occurring in that region if nobody had any religious beliefs? I think the answer has to be “probably yes”. We know this by talking to people, by looking at religious zealots throughout history. But even if our logic is correct, we cannot accurately guess how much less violence would be occurring if the region were full of atheists.
And in some sense our counterfactual thought experiment doesn’t even matter because the reality is that region is of great religious significance and you can’t really write that off as being irrelevant when several millennia prove that it is.
Also statistically countries with larger populations of atheists are significantly less violent.
Of course correlation doesn’t equal causation and it could be other environmental factors contributing to that nonviolence but nevertheless…
It’s a ton of racism too. Darker skinned Jews get all sorts of discrimination, it’s just not as extreme as someone who is Palestinian.
This is what I said and then someone blew up in my face about it when I said this in another thread/post. Why are people so hard headed when it comes to accepting reality I wonder.
Reality is an inconvenient Truth.
If it wasn’t religion it would be race or ideology or language or eye color. You could press a button and eliminate religion from history and all of these problems would still exist.