You hear that? That’s inflation jumping back up to like 10% all thanks to this bullshit.
Get yourself a marketable skill. Flipping a burger ain’t it.
Why should anyone bust their ass learning a skill like welding or going to school for information technology or becoming a dental assistant or becoming an electrician when burger flippers will only be making a few dollars an hour less? Where is the incentive to better yourself, learn and get a better job?
This is such a mess that Lemmings are going to love it! LOL
Pay everyone a wage that they can live on, at the minimum.
To be clear, as well, I am in the information technology sector and make $150/hr (calculated from my salary). So if people want to bust their ass to learn skills, it still works out well.
Welders, plumbers, electricians, etc. can make way more than $20/hr
Lol yeah in my state plumbers bill out at like 90 an hour and electricians at like 100. (Pre pandemic for what it’s worth). I get that it doesn’t all go to the tradesman but that’s still a good hourly rate
Sorry… you’re saying people without a “marketable skill” don’t deserve to make a living wage? If that’s the case, why not just exterminate them all and be done with it?
I reject the entire premise. There are a ton ton ton of jobs that are way easier to deal with than working in fast food or retail. The “marketable skill” trope is just more classist bullshit so you can focus on the guy barely squeaking by instead of the record corporate profits and massive CEO compensation. I would be willing to bet actual dollars that anyone complaining about these folks making too much money wouldn’t last a single shift.
Also, we’re talking about fucking California. Even in the low-cost areas of CA, $20/hr still means roommates and ramen.
If someone is content with flipping burgers their entire life they should be able to survive on the wages they’re paid. “Burger flippers” are still essential to the operation of the country. The service industry is a vital part of American culture, and if you want to maintain it then paying people to do the jobs you don’t want to is the only way.
Your problem should be with other professions not paying more, not that other people are finally making enough money to survive.
People SHOULDN’T be content with being just a skill less burger flipper. That’s the damn point. Go get a goddamn skill. Be the manager at a burger joint. Own a burger joint. You move up in the world by learning a skill and getting a better job.
What do you think will happen when those other professions now (rightfully so) demand more money?? You think some unicorn magic is going to keep prices down? No. Those workers with actual skills and actual degrees will make more money and companies will counter that by tacking on another 10 or 20% to their prices. So what did you just accomplish? That extra purchasing power you just got by hiking skill less jobs to $20/hr just vanished because now the things that used to cost $100 now cost $120 or more.
Poof
There went your pay raise.
That’s what happens when you aren’t elevating the skill set of workers and instead just artificially boosting the pay rate of workers with zero skills.
They should, and can be. It sounds like you’re unhappy with how your life has panned out and think everyone needs to be “grinding” 100% of the time to be better. Not everyone thinks that way or wants to. Just because you think a job is beneath you doesn’t mean it doesn’t need to be done. If all the service industry workers, who you claim have no skills btw, stopped working then the world would cease to function in a day, if not hours.
You’re blaming the workers for the problems created by the ones with money.
It’s been statistically proven that costs don’t go up when minimum wage does. Europe has higher minimum wages and yet their prices tend to be lower than ours. So there’s no actual data to support things getting more expensive due to minimum wage increases. And surprise, the prices are going to raise wether or not you get a raise.
Unskilled labour just means a job you can do with little training. Skilled labourers are like doctors, lawyer, engineers, tradespeople, etc. that take years of school and experience.
Nope. Those are in large part degreed or certified jobs, all labor requires a skill. Ask a fish to take out the trash and you’ll quickly figure out my meaning.
Words have specific meanings. We have commonly understood terminology. You can’t just deny this fact through revisionism without seriously losing your audience. Check out the agreed definition: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skilled_worker?wprov=sfti1
I just want to add, no, not all jobs require skills. Some jobs only require you to perform tasks, the tasks do not require any skill. What that means is virtually anyone can do it with very little training. For example a cook at McDonald’s only needs to be trained for about 2 weeks and they can perform the tasks required for their job. Unskilled jobs are important for young people to help them earn a living while developing skills.
Economists separate out skilled from unskilled labour for many reasons including shortages. In a skilled labour shortage for instance, it may take many years to recover (ie: doctor shortage) whereas with a shortage in unskilled labour the gap can be filled very quickly if employers are willing to raise wages. Because of the distinct quality skilled labour has we separate it out as it’s own type of labour. You couldn’t just walk into the doctors office with 2 weeks of training and start seeing patients.
As an analogy we could think of commodities vs specialized products. One stalk of corn or barrel of oil is nearly indistinguishable from another one of its kind, whereas an iPhone can’t be replaced by a Motorola and still hold the same properties.
Your own source states that it was not a thing before 1800 and is largely used by fascists for classism purposes.
All jobs require skill, point blank period. Name one task that does not require a skill, your choice and we’ll use your example for further discussion. You’re explaining jobs that require less skill not no skill. You could be a doctor with no training, would you be a very good doctor? Probably not but that isn’t at all the point.
That’s not a relevant analogy worth even discussing.
I don’t need to debate you on this. The definition is there in Wikipedia. I’m not going to use pre-19th century terminology to describe the modern labour market just because it suits your political agenda.
Skilled laborer here, engineer. Unskilled labor deserves pay no worse than 10k what I make. I didn’t choose to be an engineer because it paid well. I, and most people in my class frankly, liked the subject. That’s all.
“skilled labor” here also, ive done many many jobs and all of them require a skill. Saying there’s “skilled labor” is just a way to say there is “unskilled labor” and pay less, but I guarantee you take the CEO of Wells Fargo and put them in a dish pit for a year they will learn rather quickly there is skill to it.
Because small businesses never fail and end up with the owner losing their shirt. But I suppose they deserve for their business to fail for not pulling their bootstraps hard enough or something, right?
I see. The only two options are be a “miserable piece of shit” as a “skill-less burger flipper” or be a highly skilled burger flipper running your own business that fails within a year and you go bankrupt. Gotcha.
Why should anyone bust their ass learning a skill like welding or going to school for information technology or becoming a dental assistant or becoming an electrician when burger flippers will only be making a few dollars an hour less?
Because I sure as shit don’t want to flip my own burgers. I don’t always want to put in that effort. After I’m done working for the day I want to kick back. So what if anyone can flip a burger? Anyone can cut their own hair, but I sure as hell am not going to look good unless I pay a barber.
I’m not paying someone for having an exclusive skill. I’m paying them because they’re doing something that I don’t want to do, and they deserve to be compensated for that.
Get down from your high horse. Your job isn’t your worth. And I’m saying this as a chemical engineer who’s designed hundred million dollar equipment. The difference between what I do and what they do doesn’t warrant a 25k salary difference. Anything more than 10k is exorbitant. Our lives are only possible because someone has taken on a job that people don’t usually want. Someone keeps sewers running, picks up garbage, and cleans up after everyone. Unless you are willing to do their job 40 hours a week, put a sock in it.
You hear that? That’s inflation jumping back up to like 10% all thanks to this bullshit.
Get yourself a marketable skill. Flipping a burger ain’t it.
Why should anyone bust their ass learning a skill like welding or going to school for information technology or becoming a dental assistant or becoming an electrician when burger flippers will only be making a few dollars an hour less? Where is the incentive to better yourself, learn and get a better job?
This is such a mess that Lemmings are going to love it! LOL
Because this is the stupidest comment ever
Pay everyone a wage that they can live on, at the minimum.
To be clear, as well, I am in the information technology sector and make $150/hr (calculated from my salary). So if people want to bust their ass to learn skills, it still works out well.
Welders, plumbers, electricians, etc. can make way more than $20/hr
Again. Stupid boomer fucking comment.
Lol yeah in my state plumbers bill out at like 90 an hour and electricians at like 100. (Pre pandemic for what it’s worth). I get that it doesn’t all go to the tradesman but that’s still a good hourly rate
Sorry… you’re saying people without a “marketable skill” don’t deserve to make a living wage? If that’s the case, why not just exterminate them all and be done with it?
I reject the entire premise. There are a ton ton ton of jobs that are way easier to deal with than working in fast food or retail. The “marketable skill” trope is just more classist bullshit so you can focus on the guy barely squeaking by instead of the record corporate profits and massive CEO compensation. I would be willing to bet actual dollars that anyone complaining about these folks making too much money wouldn’t last a single shift.
Also, we’re talking about fucking California. Even in the low-cost areas of CA, $20/hr still means roommates and ramen.
Removed by mod
Are you able to have a conversation without hurling completely unnecessary insults?
If someone is content with flipping burgers their entire life they should be able to survive on the wages they’re paid. “Burger flippers” are still essential to the operation of the country. The service industry is a vital part of American culture, and if you want to maintain it then paying people to do the jobs you don’t want to is the only way.
Your problem should be with other professions not paying more, not that other people are finally making enough money to survive.
People SHOULDN’T be content with being just a skill less burger flipper. That’s the damn point. Go get a goddamn skill. Be the manager at a burger joint. Own a burger joint. You move up in the world by learning a skill and getting a better job.
What do you think will happen when those other professions now (rightfully so) demand more money?? You think some unicorn magic is going to keep prices down? No. Those workers with actual skills and actual degrees will make more money and companies will counter that by tacking on another 10 or 20% to their prices. So what did you just accomplish? That extra purchasing power you just got by hiking skill less jobs to $20/hr just vanished because now the things that used to cost $100 now cost $120 or more.
Poof
There went your pay raise.
That’s what happens when you aren’t elevating the skill set of workers and instead just artificially boosting the pay rate of workers with zero skills.
What an absolutely boneheaded move.
They should, and can be. It sounds like you’re unhappy with how your life has panned out and think everyone needs to be “grinding” 100% of the time to be better. Not everyone thinks that way or wants to. Just because you think a job is beneath you doesn’t mean it doesn’t need to be done. If all the service industry workers, who you claim have no skills btw, stopped working then the world would cease to function in a day, if not hours.
You’re blaming the workers for the problems created by the ones with money.
It’s been statistically proven that costs don’t go up when minimum wage does. Europe has higher minimum wages and yet their prices tend to be lower than ours. So there’s no actual data to support things getting more expensive due to minimum wage increases. And surprise, the prices are going to raise wether or not you get a raise.
No labor is unskilled labor.
Unskilled labour just means a job you can do with little training. Skilled labourers are like doctors, lawyer, engineers, tradespeople, etc. that take years of school and experience.
Nope. Those are in large part degreed or certified jobs, all labor requires a skill. Ask a fish to take out the trash and you’ll quickly figure out my meaning.
Words have specific meanings. We have commonly understood terminology. You can’t just deny this fact through revisionism without seriously losing your audience. Check out the agreed definition: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skilled_worker?wprov=sfti1
I just want to add, no, not all jobs require skills. Some jobs only require you to perform tasks, the tasks do not require any skill. What that means is virtually anyone can do it with very little training. For example a cook at McDonald’s only needs to be trained for about 2 weeks and they can perform the tasks required for their job. Unskilled jobs are important for young people to help them earn a living while developing skills.
Economists separate out skilled from unskilled labour for many reasons including shortages. In a skilled labour shortage for instance, it may take many years to recover (ie: doctor shortage) whereas with a shortage in unskilled labour the gap can be filled very quickly if employers are willing to raise wages. Because of the distinct quality skilled labour has we separate it out as it’s own type of labour. You couldn’t just walk into the doctors office with 2 weeks of training and start seeing patients.
As an analogy we could think of commodities vs specialized products. One stalk of corn or barrel of oil is nearly indistinguishable from another one of its kind, whereas an iPhone can’t be replaced by a Motorola and still hold the same properties.
Your own source states that it was not a thing before 1800 and is largely used by fascists for classism purposes.
All jobs require skill, point blank period. Name one task that does not require a skill, your choice and we’ll use your example for further discussion. You’re explaining jobs that require less skill not no skill. You could be a doctor with no training, would you be a very good doctor? Probably not but that isn’t at all the point.
That’s not a relevant analogy worth even discussing.
I don’t need to debate you on this. The definition is there in Wikipedia. I’m not going to use pre-19th century terminology to describe the modern labour market just because it suits your political agenda.
Skilled laborer here, engineer. Unskilled labor deserves pay no worse than 10k what I make. I didn’t choose to be an engineer because it paid well. I, and most people in my class frankly, liked the subject. That’s all.
“skilled labor” here also, ive done many many jobs and all of them require a skill. Saying there’s “skilled labor” is just a way to say there is “unskilled labor” and pay less, but I guarantee you take the CEO of Wells Fargo and put them in a dish pit for a year they will learn rather quickly there is skill to it.
The only unskilled labor that might exist is CEOs
Im not saying anything about pay, i am just stating what skilled vs unskilled labour is.
Why you angry at the dude who can’t pay rent but not mad at the dude shooting himself and his buddies into space?
Holy shit grandpa I could hear your arthritis ridden fingers writing all that bullshit, you forgot to talk about the good ol’ days btw.
Because small businesses never fail and end up with the owner losing their shirt. But I suppose they deserve for their business to fail for not pulling their bootstraps hard enough or something, right?
Removed by mod
I see. The only two options are be a “miserable piece of shit” as a “skill-less burger flipper” or be a highly skilled burger flipper running your own business that fails within a year and you go bankrupt. Gotcha.
You have no clue what you’re talking about. 20$ is still less than the minimum wage was when adjusted for inflation in the 60’s
Because I sure as shit don’t want to flip my own burgers. I don’t always want to put in that effort. After I’m done working for the day I want to kick back. So what if anyone can flip a burger? Anyone can cut their own hair, but I sure as hell am not going to look good unless I pay a barber.
I’m not paying someone for having an exclusive skill. I’m paying them because they’re doing something that I don’t want to do, and they deserve to be compensated for that.
Get down from your high horse. Your job isn’t your worth. And I’m saying this as a chemical engineer who’s designed hundred million dollar equipment. The difference between what I do and what they do doesn’t warrant a 25k salary difference. Anything more than 10k is exorbitant. Our lives are only possible because someone has taken on a job that people don’t usually want. Someone keeps sewers running, picks up garbage, and cleans up after everyone. Unless you are willing to do their job 40 hours a week, put a sock in it.
If you’re jealous of people flipping burgers, it sounds like you need a better job yourself.
This article about fast food workers in Denmark is a few years old but even more relevant today. It also shows why your comment is not valid.
https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/business/international/living-wages-served-in-denmark-fast-food-restaurants.html
You’re not welcome here, capitalist shill. No, wait - you’re actually not welcomed ANYWHERE.