No I completely disagree and don’t think that electoralism would do anything other than delay the inevitable rise to Fascism in the United States.
Stop pointing out this line of logic it’s not convincing.
The Democrats had 8 years under Obama to do literally anything to affect the status quo and failed to do so with massive push from the progressive crowd. Then we try it again with Bernie in 2016 where the Democrats made it very very clear he was not welcome.
Then we try it again in 2020 where Joe Biden promptly ignored the majority will of most voters.
It is not the job of the voters to Rally around a party that can’t figure itself out, it is the job of the party to energize those voters into acting the way they need to.
This is something that Communists recognize about their own party, why is this so hard for liberals to understand it.
You were giving yourself a handicap and saying there’s nothing you can do about it. Frankly that’s bullshit and there’s plenty to do other than sit around and waste your time in political organizations that solely focus on electoralism that aren’t going to do a damn thing to make our lives better or save us from fascism.
It is not the job of the voters to Rally around a party that can’t figure itself out, it is the job of the party to energize those voters into acting the way they need to.
yeah the DNC has long figured itself out, why do you think they are catering to centrists/moderate right wingers? because y’all won’t vote them short of a perfect candidate (which doesnt exist)
Voters: “Please stop bombing children”, “Please stop backing a genocide”, “Please stop handing out our taxes to your rich friends”, “Please stop making healthcare the number one reason for bankruptcy”, “Please stop sending people to torture prisons”, “Please make minimum wage a livable wage”
“short of a perfect candidate”
I think you might have a warped view of what “perfect” means. We just want someone who isn’t a monster.
The Democrats had 8 years under Obama to do literally anything to affect the status quo and failed to do so with massive push from the progressive crowd. Then we try it again with Bernie in 2016 where the Democrats made it very very clear he was not welcome.
And the somewhat balnaced nature of the house/senete/SC made it more difficult for trump to act in 2016. Hence my point that it does matter. Cannot build your community if you don’t have some say in these things. And you won’t because you dont vote.
It was an extremely common problem in the Obama Administration for them to embrace civility politics and back down to people like McConnell who single-handedly fucked the American people. Obama and the Democrats allowed that to happen.
Yes Trump was slowed down in 2016 by the Supreme Court but you know who could have used the four years to jump in and really hit the ground running the way Trump did in 2024? Biden in 2020 where he could have done something to actually slow Trump down and utilize some of the broad Powers the Supreme Court gave the office of president. He’s being somewhat slow down by this Supreme Court but this time he’s had four years to properly prep. Something the democrats should have done.
Oh and before you go well they wouldn’t let Biden use those Powers that’s also kind of the point. If you put that shit on the court record you’re then making the Supreme Court quite literally spell out that it’s not okay for the Democrats to do but it’s okay for the Republicans to do.
Once again you have no idea how I voted and the way I’m talking I could have easily have voted for PSL or the green party. If you want to know just ask.
Once again you have no idea how I voted and the way I’m talking I could have easily have voted for PSL or the green party. If you want to know just ask.
And going 3rd party would still be better than not voting.
Becuase it brings hard numbers about what the big tent could have done to win some seats. Libertarians have had good success in showing that if their 1% had been listened to the Rs could have picked up more seats. And the Rs have listened. They have shifted policy closer to what they want to see way more than we have to what we need.
Great then we are in agreement in this case. If people want to vote for third parties fine if people want to vote for the Democrats fine I don’t have a problem with that. My only issue is spending a lot of time harping on electoralism as the force that will save the United States. You’re right I would much rather people vote third party because it does do exactly what you want and shows the Democrats the type of policies we want but I’m pretty sure they’re already aware of the type of policies we want they just don’t want to give them to us judging by their reaction in New York.
I’m pretty sure they’re already aware of the type of policies we want they just don’t want to give them to us judging by their reaction in New York.
Which is why we need them to show up so that they are active and proven audience to cater to. As for your second part that is why protesting is still important. Again, I never said we shouldn’t do that, but if you don’t convert your protest into policy it was just a hangout. Presumably the anti israel protest do want the genocide to end right? Well if the protest does not focus on a policy that leads to something [even a cease fire so that Palestine can live to fight another day] then it really didn’t do anything. Protests are important to have your voice heard outside of election periods, but no showing on elections also means you can be ignored as the worst you will do is make noise.
No I completely disagree and don’t think that electoralism would do anything other than delay the inevitable rise to Fascism in the United States.
Stop pointing out this line of logic it’s not convincing.
The Democrats had 8 years under Obama to do literally anything to affect the status quo and failed to do so with massive push from the progressive crowd. Then we try it again with Bernie in 2016 where the Democrats made it very very clear he was not welcome.
Then we try it again in 2020 where Joe Biden promptly ignored the majority will of most voters.
It is not the job of the voters to Rally around a party that can’t figure itself out, it is the job of the party to energize those voters into acting the way they need to.
This is something that Communists recognize about their own party, why is this so hard for liberals to understand it.
You were giving yourself a handicap and saying there’s nothing you can do about it. Frankly that’s bullshit and there’s plenty to do other than sit around and waste your time in political organizations that solely focus on electoralism that aren’t going to do a damn thing to make our lives better or save us from fascism.
lol. lmao even.
yeah the DNC has long figured itself out, why do you think they are catering to centrists/moderate right wingers? because y’all won’t vote them short of a perfect candidate (which doesnt exist)
Voters: “Please stop bombing children”, “Please stop backing a genocide”, “Please stop handing out our taxes to your rich friends”, “Please stop making healthcare the number one reason for bankruptcy”, “Please stop sending people to torture prisons”, “Please make minimum wage a livable wage”
I think you might have a warped view of what “perfect” means. We just want someone who isn’t a monster.
Yep that’s absolutely been the response that we saw with Bernie Sanders in 2016 and that we’re seeing with Zohran right now in New York.
Y’all need to pick up a book and watch something other than the mainstream media. It’s rotting your brain and it shows.
And the somewhat balnaced nature of the house/senete/SC made it more difficult for trump to act in 2016. Hence my point that it does matter. Cannot build your community if you don’t have some say in these things. And you won’t because you dont vote.
It was an extremely common problem in the Obama Administration for them to embrace civility politics and back down to people like McConnell who single-handedly fucked the American people. Obama and the Democrats allowed that to happen.
Yes Trump was slowed down in 2016 by the Supreme Court but you know who could have used the four years to jump in and really hit the ground running the way Trump did in 2024? Biden in 2020 where he could have done something to actually slow Trump down and utilize some of the broad Powers the Supreme Court gave the office of president. He’s being somewhat slow down by this Supreme Court but this time he’s had four years to properly prep. Something the democrats should have done.
Oh and before you go well they wouldn’t let Biden use those Powers that’s also kind of the point. If you put that shit on the court record you’re then making the Supreme Court quite literally spell out that it’s not okay for the Democrats to do but it’s okay for the Republicans to do.
Once again you have no idea how I voted and the way I’m talking I could have easily have voted for PSL or the green party. If you want to know just ask.
And going 3rd party would still be better than not voting.
I’ll bite. Why is voting third party not any better than not voting?
Becuase it brings hard numbers about what the big tent could have done to win some seats. Libertarians have had good success in showing that if their 1% had been listened to the Rs could have picked up more seats. And the Rs have listened. They have shifted policy closer to what they want to see way more than we have to what we need.
We cannot know what that 38% wanted, but we do know more about that 1.1%. All we know is that there is a huge amount of possible allies that we are not getting involved one way or another. https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/1grcztm/voter_distribution_in_us_2024_presidential/
Great then we are in agreement in this case. If people want to vote for third parties fine if people want to vote for the Democrats fine I don’t have a problem with that. My only issue is spending a lot of time harping on electoralism as the force that will save the United States. You’re right I would much rather people vote third party because it does do exactly what you want and shows the Democrats the type of policies we want but I’m pretty sure they’re already aware of the type of policies we want they just don’t want to give them to us judging by their reaction in New York.
Which is why we need them to show up so that they are active and proven audience to cater to. As for your second part that is why protesting is still important. Again, I never said we shouldn’t do that, but if you don’t convert your protest into policy it was just a hangout. Presumably the anti israel protest do want the genocide to end right? Well if the protest does not focus on a policy that leads to something [even a cease fire so that Palestine can live to fight another day] then it really didn’t do anything. Protests are important to have your voice heard outside of election periods, but no showing on elections also means you can be ignored as the worst you will do is make noise.