I think we need to organise a massive campaign for people to cancel their entire Isp for at least a month, I’m betting all this would get reversed almost overnight.
Anything but that I fear they win and we all end up on the darknet.
People can’t even delay their non-essential shinies to make a statement against price gouging/raising bullshit… You think they’re gonna willingly sacrifice something like internet? for a month?
I mean, wouldn’t lemmy qualify as darknet because it isn’t the top 10 websites? We should be growing the Federation anyways so I’m down for that. At least they won’t ban me for making Trump jokes.
Not sure about what the norms are where you live, but most people in the US have to sign 1-year agreements for Internet service, and those who don’t typically either pay more or would pay before because they’re on a cheaper, older rate that is grandfathered in and is no longer offered by the Internet service provider.
You can do that in the US as well, but it will cost more because you wouldn’t be agreeing to a fixed term. For example, my ISP charges $25 a month for 200 mb/s if you agree to a one-year term, but it’s $40 a month if you do not agree to a one-year term. And there’s also the added inconvenience of having to go to one of the ISP’s physical stores every month and put cash into their kiosk.
They will ask for your name here when signing up, but nothing prevents you from lying about your name if you’re going to be paying in cash. They ask for an e-mail address as well, but you can say you haven’t got one, and they’ll create one for you using their own e-mail service and assign it to you. You don’t actually have to use it, but it is for receiving their bills and notices.
It is so complicated that you’re both correct and incorrect. US government added to it, yes. I’d argue the fundamental work was independent researchers from multiple countries (UK, USA, France). I’d argue the critical infrastructure was multiple non-profits.
Also the question is “what exactly is the beginning of the internet”. Is it usenet? Telnet? Arpanet?
Nope. The US government Department of Defense literally funded and created the internet. It was initially called Arpanet and was mainly US government sites. This is why few people use the .us domain. Because the initial domains .gov, .mil, .org etc were all USA sites. Usenet is independent and does not require the internet and telnet is simply one program using the internet. Most of the core TCP/IP technology was created and funded by DOD also although it is possible some of it was pre-existing.
No. The internet has so many beginnings that it is impossible to say only one group created it.
The internet, like its design, is a co-operation between many different groups.
It goes back even further than 1777, where the French mechanical telegraph was the first way to send long distance messages. And therefore is considered as one of the beginnings of the of the internet.
Or in 1830 where Brits invented a way to send electronic messages over copper cables.
Or in 1860 where they started laying sea cables to connect landmasses.
It is typical that the US claims to have invented something when it is clearly a collaborative effort.
Or in 1860 where they started laying sea cables to connect landmasses.
I never claimed that other countries do not do valuable things, but these things are not the internet.
I’m talking about something very specific: the Internet. It was created by the US DOD in the 1960’s. Without that happening what would have likely developed are a bunch of private networks like Compuserve, AOL, MSN etc that charge us by the hour.
It is typical that the US claims to have invented something when it is clearly a collaborative effort.
Why is it important to you to revise history on this particular topic? Creating the internet was not even a collaborative effort within the USA. It was done entirely by one single government agency, the Department of Defense. Nobody is saying Europeans never invented anything. Just not the internet.
The internet has so many beginnings
It has exactly one beginning. In 1969. It wasn’t even connected over the Atlantic until 1973.
That is an interesting point of view. Very USA exceptional. It’s also dumbed down a lot. ARPANET is a computer network, but it’s not internet, nor it was the first. It kickstarted popularity of computer networks in the USA and provided first FTP and (I think) first remote login.
Popularity of computer networks in USA definitely was a formative quality over the 20 years of international development of the Internet.
But saying ARPANET was the internet is like saying gramophone is Netflix.
First computer network to send packets to another computer was British NPL network. Then US government founded ARPANET, built upon that. Except that DARPA besides having own researchers outsourced to Stanford, BBN and University College of London (“How the Internet Came to Be”, quoting I forgot whom from DARPA).
Then French Cyclades computer network built upon ARPANET and proposed that multiple networks should be able to communicate with each other.
Then USA non-profit IEEE looked at all that proposed TCP/IP for cross-network communication, and that is the thing that (after many iterations over a decade) led to the Internet not being separate networks like AOL or Computerverse or whatever.
First was Spain with RETD , then France, then USA with Telenet. Then Canada. Then in 1978 we started connecting those separate networks. I think the first properly working project was
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Packet_Switched_Service between British post office and USA post office.
On those public data networks the Internet’s physical layer was built.
In USA U.S. National Science Foundation was founding more and more computer networks, including CSNET. That’s still not internet. It’s 1980 and it will take a decade of new inventions (Ethernet, LAN, DNS) and improvements & implementations (like to TCP/IP) before we will get the internet.
Here’s a nifty source for that decade, because I spent 50 minutes writing this post before I noticed I’m arguing with a guy over the internet about the internet.
Uh huh. People are addicted. I’d bet even the people with petabyte home media systems will go into withdrawal within picoseconds after not being able to get more more more more more more
I think we need to organise a massive campaign for people to cancel their entire Isp for at least a month, I’m betting all this would get reversed almost overnight.
Anything but that I fear they win and we all end up on the darknet.
I work from home. If I cancel my Internet connection, I can’t work.
Hahaha
Good luck doing that.
People can’t even delay their non-essential shinies to make a statement against price gouging/raising bullshit… You think they’re gonna willingly sacrifice something like internet? for a month?
I mean, wouldn’t lemmy qualify as darknet because it isn’t the top 10 websites? We should be growing the Federation anyways so I’m down for that. At least they won’t ban me for making Trump jokes.
No, Darknet is just a website that’s not listed anywhere. Lemmy is listed in many places.
If it doesnt show up on page 2 it doesnt exist lol
I think thats more the deep web than the dark web 😄
Soon there won’t be pages, just AI summarized slop.
Its already like that on certain websites like google. Do these companies think we are all tech illiterate olds?
Not sure about what the norms are where you live, but most people in the US have to sign 1-year agreements for Internet service, and those who don’t typically either pay more or would pay before because they’re on a cheaper, older rate that is grandfathered in and is no longer offered by the Internet service provider.
I pay for mine in cash, they don’t even know my name.
You can do that in the US as well, but it will cost more because you wouldn’t be agreeing to a fixed term. For example, my ISP charges $25 a month for 200 mb/s if you agree to a one-year term, but it’s $40 a month if you do not agree to a one-year term. And there’s also the added inconvenience of having to go to one of the ISP’s physical stores every month and put cash into their kiosk.
They will ask for your name here when signing up, but nothing prevents you from lying about your name if you’re going to be paying in cash. They ask for an e-mail address as well, but you can say you haven’t got one, and they’ll create one for you using their own e-mail service and assign it to you. You don’t actually have to use it, but it is for receiving their bills and notices.
Nah the government would love for nobody to have access to the internet lol
The US government created the internet
It is so complicated that you’re both correct and incorrect. US government added to it, yes. I’d argue the fundamental work was independent researchers from multiple countries (UK, USA, France). I’d argue the critical infrastructure was multiple non-profits.
Also the question is “what exactly is the beginning of the internet”. Is it usenet? Telnet? Arpanet?
Didn’t it all start at DARPA?
Nope. The US government Department of Defense literally funded and created the internet. It was initially called Arpanet and was mainly US government sites. This is why few people use the .us domain. Because the initial domains .gov, .mil, .org etc were all USA sites. Usenet is independent and does not require the internet and telnet is simply one program using the internet. Most of the core TCP/IP technology was created and funded by DOD also although it is possible some of it was pre-existing.
No. The internet has so many beginnings that it is impossible to say only one group created it.
The internet, like its design, is a co-operation between many different groups.
It goes back even further than 1777, where the French mechanical telegraph was the first way to send long distance messages. And therefore is considered as one of the beginnings of the of the internet.
Or in 1830 where Brits invented a way to send electronic messages over copper cables.
Or in 1860 where they started laying sea cables to connect landmasses.
It is typical that the US claims to have invented something when it is clearly a collaborative effort.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJU-KYMREbQ
I never claimed that other countries do not do valuable things, but these things are not the internet.
I’m talking about something very specific: the Internet. It was created by the US DOD in the 1960’s. Without that happening what would have likely developed are a bunch of private networks like Compuserve, AOL, MSN etc that charge us by the hour.
Why is it important to you to revise history on this particular topic? Creating the internet was not even a collaborative effort within the USA. It was done entirely by one single government agency, the Department of Defense. Nobody is saying Europeans never invented anything. Just not the internet.
It has exactly one beginning. In 1969. It wasn’t even connected over the Atlantic until 1973.
https://www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/objects-and-stories/arpanet-internet
That is an interesting point of view. Very USA exceptional. It’s also dumbed down a lot. ARPANET is a computer network, but it’s not internet, nor it was the first. It kickstarted popularity of computer networks in the USA and provided first FTP and (I think) first remote login.
Popularity of computer networks in USA definitely was a formative quality over the 20 years of international development of the Internet.
But saying ARPANET was the internet is like saying gramophone is Netflix.
First computer network to send packets to another computer was British NPL network. Then US government founded ARPANET, built upon that. Except that DARPA besides having own researchers outsourced to Stanford, BBN and University College of London (“How the Internet Came to Be”, quoting I forgot whom from DARPA).
Then French Cyclades computer network built upon ARPANET and proposed that multiple networks should be able to communicate with each other.
Then USA non-profit IEEE looked at all that proposed TCP/IP for cross-network communication, and that is the thing that (after many iterations over a decade) led to the Internet not being separate networks like AOL or Computerverse or whatever.
Now we’re getting closer to the internet and it’s time for https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_data_network
First was Spain with RETD , then France, then USA with Telenet. Then Canada. Then in 1978 we started connecting those separate networks. I think the first properly working project was https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Packet_Switched_Service between British post office and USA post office.
On those public data networks the Internet’s physical layer was built.
In USA U.S. National Science Foundation was founding more and more computer networks, including CSNET. That’s still not internet. It’s 1980 and it will take a decade of new inventions (Ethernet, LAN, DNS) and improvements & implementations (like to TCP/IP) before we will get the internet.
Here’s a nifty source for that decade, because I spent 50 minutes writing this post before I noticed I’m arguing with a guy over the internet about the internet.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Internet (there is a nice timeline list there).
Uh huh. People are addicted. I’d bet even the people with petabyte home media systems will go into withdrawal within picoseconds after not being able to get more more more more more more
Better would be to reject sites like reddit. Make them suffer instead.